https://youtubetranscript.com/?v=tKPZvjYOT68
So we gotta share with the employees. Because without employees, we can’t make a profit. And if employees make more money, they have more purchasing power. The economy functions better. But we must open up. We must. It’s so crucial that small enterprise that we don’t tie them up in chains and with regulations. Hello everyone watching and listening. Today I have the honor to speak with Frank Stronach, founder and CEO of Magna International, one of Canada and the world’s great companies. Frank built that company from nothing, starting in the 1950s. It’s quite a story. We discussed the keys to motivating yourself, to starting and maintaining a successful and expanding business. Why that’s a good thing for yourself and everybody else. The idea contained within his corporate constitution. It’s an economic charter of rights, which advocates for the input, autonomy, and profit sharing among all workers, management, shareholders, et cetera. And I’m very much looking forward to talking about it with him. Hello, Mr. Stronach. It’s very, very nice to see you. We met a couple of months ago at a restaurant in Toronto, and I had the opportunity to talk to you about your business ventures over the last five or six decades, which I found extraordinarily interesting. And in the intervening period of time, I’ve read one of your books, the one that’s more autobiographical. And I’m very interested in your story. I thought you would make a particularly good podcast guest because one of the things I do with my podcast is walk people through the lives of successful individuals, because I think it would be better if people believed that they could move forward successfully in the world and that they were equipped with some knowledge about how to do that. And I think that’s something we could really concentrate on, focusing in on. I know it’s very important to you. In this podcast, you came to Canada in the 1950s. We’ll go through your story autobiographically. You came armed with a tiny bit of money, some actual skill, some determination, and out of that, you built a massive business empire. Let’s start with this. Not everyone listening and watching are going to know what Magna Enterprises is. So would you do us the favor first of laying out your business empire? Tell people what it is that you do and what you’ve accomplished, how you’re spread out through the world, what you guys manufacture. Just lay out the story, the description of Magna. Okay, I’ve always said life is a question of fate and circumstances. Being at the right places at the right time with the right ingredients. As it happened, I was born in a working class family. When I finished my schooling and I had one or two years practical experience, I wanted to see the world. I applied for a visa to South Africa, Australia, the United States, and Canada. Sometimes I’m a little tough on the Canadian bureaucracy, but I’m saying it’s still the best because they came first forward with a visa. So I landed in Weebeck City. I took the cheapest fare I could. From Holland on a coal freighter. I arrived in Weebeck in, I think it was about April 1954. The immigration officer asked me, do you know anybody in Canada? I said no. So I said, well, then you go to Montreal. So I moved to Montreal. So I took a train to Montreal, but I didn’t know anybody. My English was reasonable, okay. There were some English speaking people on that ship. And so I tried to practice my English. So anyway, I knew because I had 5,000. I rented a garage. Actually, it was the gate house of Standard Products in Dufferin and DuPont in Toronto. And the size was about maybe double the garage. I bought a few used machines. I had a 10,000 you spend by December 22nd, Birch Gold will send you a free gold bar. Just text Jordan to 98-98-98 to claim eligibility before Black Friday. Birch Gold can even help you convert an existing IRA or 401k into an IRA in gold for no money out of pocket, and you still get the free gold bars. With an A plus rating with the Better Business Bureau and thousands of satisfied customers, you can count on Birch Gold to help you navigate transitioning an existing IRA or 401k into an IRA in gold. Don’t let your savings become a victim of the further devaluation of the dollar through more spending. Text Jordan to 98-98-98. And so what machines did you learn to operate when you were doing your training? And you also mentioned earlier that you were confident in putting yourself forward as a good problem solver. And so what was the relationship between learning those machines? What machines did you learn, and how did that facilitate your development as a problem solver? Interesting, the first one, I came out of high school, my first day at that factory, I needed a platform because I couldn’t quite reach up. I was 14 years of age, I couldn’t reach up. There was a vice grip mounted on the thing here. And then there was a piece of steel. The piece of steel was about four inches square. We took two people to lift that steel up on the vice grip. And then we had a hacksaw, a metal hacksaw. We had to cut the piece down four inches square. And that took maybe a week, okay, till we cut the thing down. And then it took maybe about three, four weeks. We had to file it perfectly square. So that’s, I mean, it’s amazing thing, what that leads to and how you accumulate the precision work, right? I did a similar school in Canada where we, we had a school here to teach young kids how to be drill and die makers, right? But anyway, so you go and then we learn, we learn things on a lathe where you make round things or milling machine and laid on precision computerized machines, et cetera, et cetera. So you go to a stage, right? Okay. So anyway, that’s what we, I did my first job then in Toronto as a drill and die maker. We made a stampede die, right? We did to maybe punch out a piece of metal and with some holes in it. And so that’s basically what the drill and die maker does. And as you go along, it gets more and more sophisticated. Right, right. So you got familiarized with a wide variety of tools and the ability to make precision parts. Now, you said you also became a good problem solver. And then you also developed this idea that you could rent your own garage and start producing your own tools. Now, one of the things you said was that when you went out to sell your services, you told your potential customers that you could solve a problem. And if you didn’t, they didn’t have to pay you. And the reason I want to focus on that in part is because I want to know how you developed the vision to rent that garage to begin with, but also how you knew that the proper thing to sell to potential customers was your service as a problem solver, right? Because what you’re saying to them essentially is, well, you guys have a problem and it’s plaguing you and you need it solved. And I’m the guy that can solve it. And I’m willing to demonstrate my capabilities, which is really an excellent approach to sales because you want to find out what the person’s problem is and you want to be the solution. But how did you develop that problem solving ability and your confidence in it? And then why did you think it was worth taking the risk to rent that first garage? Jordan, you asked great questions. You mean those have to be answered. The reason why I’m sitting here is, look, I want to roll off the experience I accumulated. There’s thousands and thousands and thousands of young Canadians out there, which could do the same thing if we teach them the basics, right? And I think a society would be much better off with thousands of smaller companies than one or two large companies, right? That’s the idea. So anyway, so I opened up that factory. I could solve a few problems. I got some orders and I, like I said, after two years, I had about 20 people. And I noticed my foreman was a little different, right? Because when you just got, you work so closely together. His name was Herman. I said, Herman, what’s the matter with you lately? Well, he said, Frank, I’m thinking of opening my own factory. Hmm. I said, I sympathize with that. That’s what I did too. I said, look, why don’t we talk tomorrow? Maybe we can find a better solution. That evening I was talking to myself and I said to myself, if that foreman’s gonna leave me, that would stifle my growth. I didn’t like that. The next reason was if that foreman’s gonna leave me, I got to do all the work myself. I liked it even less. The third reason was if I hire a new foreman and I don’t show him how to run the business, I still got to do all the work. And if I hire a new foreman and I show him how a business is run, it’s just a question of time before he goes out and opens up his new factory. I think the key is we need, we need those experience. There is this huge potential, right? This huge energy which lies dormant in people. We’re gonna teach them the right way. So I think it’s important while I’m still, I have everything in my mind quite clearly that we record that and it’s great that you, your skill is to ask the right question. How come and how what, right? Okay, so I’m delighted to sit here. So you grew very rapidly. So there’s two mysteries there to me because one of the things I’ve noticed with small businesses, for example, is that it’s very difficult to get your first customers, right? It’s very difficult to get from zero to one. Once you have a customer or two, the next customers start to be easier because you can refer them to other customers you have, but getting those first people to decide that you’re the person when no one else has done it or has been willing to show that faith, that can be very tricky. So what do you think you managed successfully, how do you think you managed to present yourself successfully to the first people that you offered your services to? Well, price of quality doesn’t function, right? And if you have a lot of knowledge and you transmit that knowledge to other people, then you can give a great service, better pricing, better functioning machinery, better tools. So that’s the very key and that’s what I would like to transmit. So fortunately, around that time, that’s what I’m always saying, life is a question of fated circumstances, being at the right place at the right time. Around the end in the early 60s, there was a free trade arrangement signed with the United States. And I see this huge potential out there. I should say, I didn’t finish up when I talked the next day with my foreman, where I said to him, look, why don’t we open up a new factory, you own a third? And I said, no more overtime, I own two thirds. And by the end of the year, we take pro rata some monies out and we leave some monies in for expansions. He said, do you mean it? I said, yes. We went right away to a lawyer and signed the thing here and the guy hustled like crazy. He spent more time in there. That was his factory. Basically, I took the next foreman, the next foreman, the next foreman, the next foreman. I said, business is easy, right? And then when I had about, I think it was about six or seven factories and the free trade arrangement came into being, I saw this enormous potential up there. Up to that now, I only shared with the foreman. I said, and then I got to know the United States better, Canada better, the power of the unions, the size of the unions. And I said, if I, I would have to do certain things to be competitive. So I had a friend of mine, machinery dealer, and he said, I can explain to him, I really should go public because I want to have the workers also participate. Well, he says, I know a fellow which his name is, I’ll remember the name. It’s a model, but anyway, he gave me the name. I met him at the ski hill. We went skiing to get up at George Beaks and he said, look, that was Magnelectronics. He said, I have a certain age I would like to retire. Why don’t you sell your companies in Magnelectronics and you have close to control and then you could put that program in that where we also, where you can share the profits with workers. So that’s what I finally did. I was totally green when it comes down to public company, right? I did not have total control. I had a bought there, right? And they were more in driving the stock up, right? In the end, the defense industry was very, they were mainly Magnelectronics, mainly defense work, right? And that was very popular and I was an automotive and I said after a year, so I said, I don’t think this makes a lot of, I said, I want to be out, okay? And they said, I sell my stock on the market. So they pleaded with me, please sell the stock to us. And I said, fine, no problem. And give us a year time. And I said, fine. They were basically okay guys, but the market kind of went down, the shares, they didn’t have the monies. I never sued anybody and I just said, look, under the circumstances, you guys can’t be on the board. And then I put in different directors. And after a while, I went to the board and right to the public and say, I forego about 25% of my stocks. If you the shareholders vote for multiple vote. Cause I came to the conclusion, I want to run things and I can’t have 20 guys or 50 guys left and right to discuss and debating forever, right? So I had the shareholders voted for that. Then I said, in return, I also give your thing a certain discipline. This is where I put the corporate constitution in. That if I had control, I only could take out so much. There was clear cut control what management could do. And that sort of became the Magna environment. But yeah. Well, let’s go back to your foreman. So you had said that when you made that arrangement with him, that you valued his work and you wanted him around and you were concerned that if he left, well, all of that work would fall on your shoulders again and also stop you from moving ahead. And you sat down and contemplated what sort of deal you would have to make with him in order for his needs to be met in yours. And there’s something very important there about the nature of a deal. People often think that with a deal, you try to win or with a deal, you try to compromise. But my sense with a proper negotiation is that you wanna figure out what you want so that you’re thrilled to progress with the deal and you wanna figure out what your partner wants. So he’s thrilled to progress with the deal. Because if you set it up that way, then your interests are aligned and you’re both gonna work as hard as you can autonomously. Now, you knew your foreman had the same kind of entrepreneurial vision you did and you wanted to unleash his abilities. And so you offered him a third of the company. You said you’d take two thirds. And then you said he was thrilled, which is a good thing to have happen in a partner. And he went off and like treated this factory like it was his own, partly because it was. And then you said you duplicated that subsidiary structure across six factories and then expanded much more dramatically. And you also at that point, also noted that that principle of distributed ownership should be brought down to the workers. So you were starting to develop that as an explicit philosophy. Now, why do you think it was that you realized that your foreman needed ownership? Why do you think you were willing to grant it to him? And why do you think that the agreement that you made, which was that you would own one third of the, or that he would own one third of the company and you would own two thirds, why do you think that was a desirable and compelling motivational arrangement for your foreman? First of all, a deal, it gotta be a deal for both sides. It’s gotta be good, right? And as a company grows, circumstances might change a bit, et cetera, et cetera. So you make provisions if you can. The reason why I think he was delighted with the deal is when we had verbal arrangements, I never went back on my word. I think that’s a very key, right? So he felt comfortable when they say we take out the third, right? We take out a portion in a pro rata. So he felt kind of comfortable, right? That’s very crucial. Like later on, if I, you know, once when they had about 30 or 40 or 50 or 100 factories and I had a prospective manager, which I interviewed, I said, look, there’s the name, the addresses of 100 factories. Like whoever manager you wanna choose and ask him how I run things, okay? The message what I wanted to get across, if you promise something, you must keep it. Doesn’t matter what the thing is, because if you got the ability, you can always make monies. If you lose your reputation, you can never repair. So I think I had a reputation build up. And again, when they said small companies, you don’t need a formal structure. It’s kind of loose. It’s pure free enterprise. Like when I was small, when I had about 20, 30, 40 workers, I showed you my bank book and said, look, this is a contract we have here. If you do XXX, I shared with you, right? So you don’t, it’s pure free enterprise. And that’s what I wanna get across. That’s pure capitalism. But capitalism, if we don’t change, if we do not like workers participate, capitalistic system is self-destructive. And let me give you a quick story, right? I spent a lot of time in Washington. At one time I had a meeting with the leader of the house, Mitch McConnell. He’s the senator from Kentucky, was the president of the Senate. I had a farm in Kentucky, so I knew him. So I said, Mitch, let’s, you know, I’d like to see you one of these days. So we arranged, I met him and I said, Mitch, America did great, we had the free enterprise system. And without free enterprise, there’s no free society. So we must do everything we can to have free enterprise. But I said, free enterprise got a major problem. So he said, what do you mean by that? I said, Mitch, more and more capital is helped by few and fewer. And I said, in nature, when a species does not reproduce itself, another species will take over. And the laws of nature are much stronger than any man-made law, right? And that’s what happens now. That’s the way we’re gonna go. So we gotta share with the employees. Because without employees, we can’t make a profit. And if employees make more money, they have more purchasing power. The economy functions better. So we must have the large companies, they must have more of a discipline because they sometimes they run by institutions, by, and they have got no more affinity for people that they just look at the share price, they look at the profits. So it’s not there, right? So the owners are not there anymore. So anyway, we need a discipline there. But we must open up, we must. It’s so crucial that small enterprise that we don’t tie them up in chains and with regulations. The Bible is the root of all wisdom, inspiration, and spiritual nourishment. 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The Hallow App also helps you connect with a community of like-minded individuals, sharing experiences, insights, and encouragement along the path to spiritual growth. Download the app for free at Hallow.com slash Jordan. You can set reminders and track your progress along the way. Enrich your education and nurture your mind and soul today. Download the Hallow App at Hallow.com slash Jordan. That’s Hallow.com slash Jordan. Hallow.com slash Jordan for an exclusive three month free trial of all 10,000 plus prayers and meditations. Okay, now you highlighted three things. The first thing you highlighted was that the people that you were negotiating could trust you. Now, people who are cynically critical of capitalism tend to justify that by noting the sort of winner-take-all problem that you described. And then they presume that if you’re greedy and you shovel everything towards yourself, you’re most likely to, let’s say, win in the capitalist enterprise. But you pointed out something very much contrary to that, three things actually. The first is that you don’t develop a reputation by screwing other people. You develop a reputation by telling other people what you’re going to do and then bloody well do it. And that you should also write down what you say you’re going to do so that everybody remembers and knows exactly what the deal is. That you said that by the time you were negotiating, let’s say with a foreman who wanted to leave, you had enough track record with him of trust so that he believed that you would do what you said you were going to do, and he could envision a future with you without having to worry about your motivations. So you established your trust. Then you also realized that he was gonna be a hell of a lot more motivated if he was an owner in the system, right? And so your answer to the problem of capitalism isn’t exactly less capitalism. It’s a much more distributed and generous form of capitalism that pulls everybody, the workers and the managers and owners, into the profit-making structure. Now, the other advantage, this is so cool, because I’ve learned this as I’ve built enterprises too. If you make a really great deal with someone and the person’s good and they’re competent and they’re honest and they’re productive and they’re generous, if you make a really good deal with them and you can let them go off on their own, that means that they’re gonna take care of a thousand details on their own, keeping their own affairs in order that you don’t have to take care of anymore. You don’t have to micromanage. And that means that you can go off and expand your enterprise and do your own thing. And so the advantage you gain by distributing more responsibility, let’s say to an extremely competent foreman, the advantage you gain is massive freedom. And you also gain the advantage of the fact that that foreman who now partakes in the enterprise is gonna be much more motivated to make the enterprise work. And so even if you end up paying him more, like a third of the company, let’s say, or the profit share that you described, the overall profit is gonna be so much greater that there’s nothing in it but benefit for you and for him. And then you also pointed out, and this is a very crucial thing for people to understand because this is where the left-wing critics of capitalism actually have a point, although it’s not a problem that’s specific to capitalism, which is that as an enterprise grows, and it doesn’t matter what the enterprise is, the benefits tend to flow into the hands of fewer and fewer people. And that destabilizes the whole damn enterprise because you get too many slaves on the bottom and not enough pharaohs on the top. And that produces discontent and dissatisfaction and a motivation, and that can bring the whole damn system to a halt. So your solution to that was to set up this constitution that you described, which also enabled you to grow. I’m gonna review it again, because it’s very, very important. This is the economic charter of rights. So your management philosophy is to distribute responsibility responsibility and profit, and to make that an explicit part of the agreement. And the deal is 20% of the profits go to the shareholders, 6% to the management, 10% to the workers, 2% to charity, 7% reinvested in research and further development. And you make that explicit. Now, the trust you described is also crucial because the workers with whom you’re arranging to share the profits aren’t going to trust that deal or go along with it if they think you’re gonna gerrymander the books on the profit side, right? They actually have to actually believe that you’re gonna play a straight game. But if you can explain to them that, well, you’re gonna play a straight game because if you motivate them properly, they’re gonna work a hell of a lot harder and everybody’s gonna make a lot more money and the products are gonna have higher quality and we’re gonna sell more, then there’s absolutely nothing there for people to, steal selfishly and run away with. There’s only the possibility that all that distributed responsibility and ability is gonna produce more and more, well, it’s gonna be more and more productive and more and more generous. Now, I asked you when we met at the restaurant a couple of months ago, whether or not you had run into labor problems as you grew, because going from no employees to 100,000, you’re obviously going to be dealing with potential labor issues and you’ve said that as a consequence of this constitution and the trustworthiness of the process that you’ve had, that you’ve been able to pay your workers a premium rate, but that you’ve also had almost no labor trouble. Is that correct? Have I got that right? Yeah, that is correct. And the interesting part about it is, we were basically in the automobile industry and the Order Workers Union was maybe the strongest union in America, right? Okay, so anyway, the president of the Canadian Order Workers Union, his name was Bas Hargrove, or still is his name. And I called him and I said, Bas, let’s have lunch. The two of us, we have an obligation. What are we going to do to maintain jobs and create new jobs? I said, let’s have lunch. So we agreed and then we sat down and said, Bas, it shouldn’t be that difficult to put on one page what’s important for the workers and on one page what’s important for business. And we call that a framework of economic justice. After a few weeks, we managed it a bit. We agreed on the thing, on that structure. He said to me, I might not get it through to my membership. Okay, but he did get it through. And we incorporated that. We took two factories where we said, look, we’re gonna try and see how that works, right? The part was our workers were very upset. They said, look, we find we are happy. You wanna change a total different thing here. I took, I said, look, I have an obligation. We live in a society. We are a very important part of that society. We gotta find ways and means. Can we learn from that, right? Because when I made my, if you have a few hundred factories, when I made my rounds, I made it a habit always to at least every month I see maybe a new factory which I haven’t seen for a while. When I made my rounds, I got the workers together and I said, look, those are the basic principles. But I said, let’s make one thing clear. No government can guarantee your jobs. No union can guarantee your jobs. Not even magnet can guarantee your jobs. But I’m the head of the magnet, I can guarantee one thing, the basic principles. And that is the very key as it is, if we, if labor and management work together and make a quality product, that’s the best guarantee. That’s the best guarantee. And we can make the quality product if we communicate. And we put a very important structure in our company, right? We audit the human capital. It’s a very unusual thing here. First of all, I put in a hotline. I had some trusted people. And we got a big notice in the factories. If you’re unhappy with something, that’s something discrimination or unfairness or women get bested by, whatever it is, call a hotline. But you don’t have to give your name. And I had people then investigate, those were trusted people. And now when I would talk with managers, they said, that’s one of the best things you did. Because the first reaction when they did that, they said, are you spying on us? They were unhappy. But now it’s another, because if you have an unhappy employee, unhappiness is contagious. If you got unhappy employees, there’s no way you can make a quality product at a competitive price. So that’s very, so we’ve done that on a verbal thing where we have a den, we did actually an audit, a human audit where an employee got a den we love with no name on it. And they could take it home and fill it out. Various questions, is it safe, is it fair, discrimination, whatever, you could fill it out. And there’s only one in an envelope, no name on it, and you drop it in a box. And it’s collected and then we analyze it. And we could see right away if there was a problem. We could see it. So that is another worry because as a manager, let’s say the average factory was about 200 people in our, and that’s another very important thing to become. I always had efficiency experts come to me, Christ, you got over 400 factories, reduce it, reduce it maybe to 20 or whatever. That means to have maybe five, 10,000 people per factory. People become a number. It doesn’t work, it doesn’t work. So we, look, you should never forget the human side. By having smaller factories and let’s say the factories located more in the northerly region, it’s run like a factory. If hunting season comes and some people wanna take some time off, other people jump in and say, look, I cover for you, I’ve worked the extra time. It’s everything relates to people, the workers gotta be an equal. And I said to myself and I said to the managers, your number one thing is every day you gotta work. Are you respected by the workers? That’s your main aim. You gotta be respected. And once when you build that thing, then you be productive, right? You be, they think of, the workers think of better ways to make things, right? And there, and business is easy. All you have to do is make a better product for a better price. That’s as easy as it is. According to a recent report, Planned Parenthood continues to rake in billions despite dwindling clients. The biggest takeaway here is that Planned Parenthood is generating vast profits, including millions in taxpayer funding. With the help of Pre-born, you and me, we are stealing their clientele, meaning the babies they are trying to kill. Pre-born operates on a very slim budget as they rescue over 200 babies’ lives every day and they receive no government funding. Pre-born’s network of clinics are situated in the darkest corners, competing head to head with the abortion giants. They need our help now more than ever. When you donate 5,000 you earn, and suppose you earn 50,000, do you get them points for knowledge, right? And the more points you have, the more you share out at the bottom, right? But it’s pre formulated, right? So we want to reward loyalty and performance. The managers are separate, right? They purely participate in their factory. I’ve always said there is no bad employees, only bad managers, and the bad, or there’s very few bad managers, or let me rephrase it, there’s a few, there’s some managers which need more learning experience, right? But there’s very few bad managers, but there’s no bad employees, okay? Because it’s our thing to assist them in learning into what makes a factory run, and I guess as a businessman, it’s what makes the economy run in a country. The economy, we need a new model of the economy, and I think Canada could be the first country with an economic chart of rights. The economic chart of rights, it’s fundamental. How many companies, okay, you’ve had a lot of success with this particular model of corporate governance, and it’s allowed you to grow very rapidly, to develop a very large enterprise, and to maintain it across now quite a long time, because it’s about 50 years, 70 years, 70 years. That’s very long in the corporate world. How widespread have your ideas of constitutional profit sharing become? And what, in your view, has been the impediment to their wider acceptance? Well, keep in mind, I was for many years on the corporate governance part of NASDAQ or the New York Stock Exchange, okay, where we take a look, minority interests, or the market not behaving properly, right? And we worked that, we interfaced with the Sec. Security Commission, and brought forward that the market needs changing, okay? There’s no different in here. It’s a constant, and it should be done within the company, right? And so it’s expected that management live to certain standards, employees have to live in society. We have to teach standards. We don’t teach enough our kids what it’s all about, okay? And I moved to, after I finished my schooling in Austria, I moved to Switzerland, right? It was a great learning experience. It’s a great country with great people. It’s made relative easy to demand a referendum, okay? And so on important things to have a referendum said. About two years, I think it was in the Wall Street Journal, Swiss people defeated the referendum to have more vacation. I think the referendum was to move the vacation up from three weeks to five weeks. The people defeated that and said, we cannot afford it. Right, right. It’s the ultimate democracy. So why have the ideas that you’ve put forward in relationship to the corporate constitution not being accepted and implemented by more companies, do you think? I mean, your model has shown that if you’re more generous with the profit distribution, and if you formalize that distribution, you seem to gain an increment productivity. And so why, also given the fact that capital tends to accrue in the hands of fewer and fewer people, and that that’s a problem for the maintenance of the popularity of the capitalist system in general, why do you think your economic model hasn’t met with more acceptance? Is it just that it’s too new? I mean, new ideas take a long time to distribute. What’s the impediment? I wrote a book, The Treat Factor, right? And homosapiens are born with some greed. Without greed, homosapiens cannot exist. And, but greed after a certain thing, it’s the most destructive for us. So, like I said, I’ve pinned on the corporate governance board, it’s what an education. We’ve made it too complicated for public companies, right? The paragraphs, like, I mean, it’s so complicated that it’s just a feasible, I think, right? So young entrepreneurs, they think, ah, that’s, it’s, and so everything is more complicated. So we gotta get back again. And there was nothing wrong with Canada about 40, 50, 60 years ago. So everything functioned quite well. So we have gotten into that, where we analyze, where we, look, when you look at our, what the best way to bring it across is, when you take a look at our DAX code, codex, it’s a deck book with thousands of paragraphs. Keep in mind, when I fully run magna, I had 20 lawyers on one side of my office and 20 financial experts just on the other side. When I went to the lawyers, since I like to do X, X, X, is that within the law. Well, they say that’s within the law. I went to the thing here now, how is it treated from a DAX point of view? After a week, you know, you get the thing, it’s so complete, it’s so great, it could be the way. But they said, there’s some experts down in the city, which, so you gift, you send them the problem or the clarification, after a few weeks, they get a big bill and they say, it can be either way. So everything, every paragraph, there’s thousands and thousands, they’re more confoluted than the others. Until we have a DAX system, black and white, where everybody can fill out down, we have, how can a society function? The DAX system is slanted in favor of specialized interest groups. That’s the dilemma. Well, so you mentioned earlier in our conversation that you believe that it would be very difficult for you to start your dual garage basic factory today, that the regulatory burden would be just too high. And so, you know, as societies move forward in time, they tend to accrue more and more rules, right? They tend to stagnate themselves and that’s a constant danger. I mean, one of the advantages to the capitalist system is that large unwieldy enterprises that no longer function get killed by the market disappear. And we don’t really have an equivalent function of death, let’s say in the bureaucratic realm, we have elections, but that doesn’t really affect the bureaucratic state. Do you have any sense of how it might be possible to clear out some of the regulations that are impeding entrepreneurial development? And have you had any success in talking to politicians, let’s say in Canada, about how some of that house cleaning might occur? The politicians can’t do it. I could give you many reasons, or maybe some other times we have a little more time, but again, I want to point out, no change our approach. It’s not the fault of the bureaucrats, it’s the fault of the system, but one way a civilized way would be not to rehire till he reaches certain status, right? And it’s got to relate to the GDP, to the GDP, to what we can create. It needs X, same as a management needs X managers, the same a society could have where to it and on the bureaucratic side, a certain percentage related to the market, to what does the country produce? Let’s talk a little bit about the future now. One of the things we discussed when we first met was a new product that you’re bringing to market and on the cheap and easily accessible transportation side, especially for urban commuters, do you want to talk about the product that you guys are bringing to market soon and where you’re going to build that and what your vision is for that? Yes, about two years ago, the premier called me and he said, I got a problem. I said, what? He said, General Motors is closing, you know the car industry. I got inducted into American Automotive Hall of Fame in 2018. So I said, yeah, give me a few days, give me a week, I’ll bring forward something. At around that time, I had to go down a few times. I should say the Magna Head Office is in Aurora, which is about 21 minutes down to the 401th, right? So anyway, around that time, I had to go down a few times. What used to take me half an hour from the outer ring to the inner ring, to Bay Street, now would take, if everything’s fine, would take an hour, but it could take two hours. So I got stuck a few times, two hours, and I said, what a waste of human energy, what a waste of non-renewable energies, but most of all, what to inhale the carbon monoxide for two hours on the way in, two hours home. I said, what damage that does to the health, the well-being of people. So anyway, I went back to the workbench, okay? I should say Magna is a major car manufacturing company. We have one factory where we produce all the Mini-Coopers for the whole world. We shipped out of our factories right under the showrooms, right across the world. We developed the Aston Martin to repeat, right from our factory ship to the showrooms. A very unique car, no welding, no screwing. It was built like an airplane. It was glued together, right? But anyway, so I think I’ve done that for 60 years. I came to the conclusion it’s gotta be a small electric car. I think we coined the phrase micromobility, and in loose terms, micromobility means you need, you gotta be able to park at least four of those in a regular car parking spot to be more precise. They cannot be wider than three and a half feet, not longer than seven feet. And you can plug it in in any electrical outlet, one then wolf, and in a few hours, you can go 100 kilometers with it for less than a dollar, or you can have a quick charging too. So it will change transportation. Its main purpose is to get people from your home to your workplace and back home. We also done a small pickup truck which will do inner city merchandise delivery. And I should be in mass production about two, three months. The fact is just around, we got the first brother dice coming off the line, and it will change transportation for many reasons. The primary reason is, there’s only so much oil in the grounds. The reason why gasoline prices are relatively cheap is, the United States is utilizing 120 million tons of grain to convert it into ethanol to keep the gasoline price down. You can’t do that for long because the next wave will be, or the critical wave for society will be food shortages in the world, not triggered by the, it would have come anyway, but will be accelerated quicker by what goes on in the Ukraine because the Ukraine is a major food producer. So, and the United States can’t do that. So the gasoline prices will go up dramatically, I would say will double in two, three years. But most of all, I predicted eight years, gasoline will be rationalized, will only be available for essential purposes. One of the essential purpose will be electric trucks, I got electric, but me, gasoline trucks will haul the food from the farms to the cities, because the grid power will not be there for large electric trucks. Or you will not solve the traffic chains because there is the grid power isn’t there. It would take much time to do, and you might have to go with small atomic powered stations, right? But that’s another thing here, right? But the grid system isn’t there. I built the first hydrogen car with BMW about 15 years ago. Yes, it works, but much more cumbersome, much more expensive. And I see a small electric car, that’s the answer for now for the next 50, 100 years. Do you wanna talk a little bit about what it looks like and what people can expect to see and experience when they use this particular vehicle? Okay, they’re basically small, right? We, again, it’s main purpose is to go from your home to your workplace and back home, okay? And that means we have stifled the speed at 32 kilometers per hour, right? So basically the insurance be so minimal or practically none because you can’t do any damage. So, and two people can sit in the car and the people in the pickup truck, there’s four people can sit in there. It could be a taxi, it could be a merchandise delivery vehicle, so yeah, I think we have, we showed it on the Canadian Auto Show, we had the biggest lineups and thousands of people drove it, they got all enthusiastic about it. And the key question is, how do we gotta get around? That’s the key question. Well, it looked like a kind of a hybrid between electric car and a motorcycle essentially. And you mentioned as well, that many families have a conundrum where because there are two people working and they tend to work in different locations that they need two vehicles and one of the vehicles and both vehicles are very expensive and they’re over determined for the purpose. People need a commuter vehicle essentially as well as an ordinary vehicle to do all the other things they need to do with it. And your sense was that this vehicle would supply a low cost alternative to people who need, primarily need transportation to work and back and who wouldn’t be using the vehicle, who would be using their other vehicle for primary purposes other than that. Does that seem about right? A few changes. When I looked down the road, now usually call it the middle class, there’s a two car garage, two cars, right? Because the husband maybe went to work, in most some cases the wife do, but in many cases the wife stayed home, she had kids, had to bring the kids to school or to shopping, et cetera, et cetera. So when I look down the road, I think I need a special permit for a large electric car for a family that you could go to the cottage or that for special purpose, not for daily commute. And do you have two or three, you could actually could get four small cars in a regular two car garage. And this is where kids, so I see their friends, so where the wife or the husband go shopping, so you to run around, right? To do things with up with your friends and go to school or whatever, go to work and just it’s reliable transport at low cost and no greenhouse gases. I would like to thank you very much for the time you spent today. I think it’s very useful to explain to people, I think it’s extremely useful to have explained to people. Jordan, I don’t want to flatter you, you are gifted to bring out the inner workings of a lot of machinery, a lot of people. And that’s, as a technician, yes, I be able to trans reasonable well, but you have a gift to transmit it that it be easily understood by the people. So I’m delighted that I came, I’m delighted that I was invited. Well, what struck me in our conversations was the importance of disseminating your vision for fostering a generous productivity. You created an enterprise that’s distributed. You said that you’ve made millionaires out of many of your foremen, out of people who’ve rose to the position where they could run their own factories. You’ve given people the opportunity to have a tremendous amount of autonomy under your overarching authority and to bring out the best of them as they build their own factories and as they employ more and more people. And you’ve managed also to distribute that responsibility and opportunity all the way down to the workers. And it’s absolutely obvious to me that there’s never been a more effective machine for producing wealth than the free exchange capitalist system. The data on that are crystal clear. As soon as you stop countries from doing absolutely idiotic economic things and free up their population under a quasi-capitalist market, then everybody becomes richer. Then you have the emergent problem of inequality, and that’s a problem. But your system of distributed profits, given that it’s honestly run, is a reasonable solution to that problem. And it’s very good to hear you talk about how motivated you’ve been to build the company and to produce all the products you have, but also how much you’ve been able to motivate other people while being productive and solving the problem of unequal distribution. So thank you very much for bringing that to everyone’s attention. I got to add a few more words. My motivation was never to be hungry anymore and live in dignity. And the reason is, it’s very important, if a manager, let’s say a magnum manager, wanted to make more money, he had to replace himself and has to open up another factory. So a manager could replace himself maybe 20, 30, or 50 times, and then he gets a cut from each factory where he made a contribution, a percentage of the profits. And this way, some of them, their yearly income maybe was 10 million. So the more they made, the more the shareholders made, the more the more workers were made. When I said it’s so important that we have that we have smaller companies, that young kids got to see, I want to be able to do like Joe Brown. I want to make 50 million or 100 million or like the football player, like the hockey player. We must give them the motivation, right? But let it be, right? Some people are quite happy. We turn X, X, X. Let it be. I love to be the Lester song. Let it be, let it be. Let everybody be. Let everybody be. Let everybody find their own way to happiness. Thank you. My pleasure, man. To everybody watching and listening, thank you very much for your time and attention. The film crew up here in Northern Ontario and down where Frank is, thank you for the flawless technical, the provision of flawless technical expertise on this front to the DailyWire Plus for making these conversations possible. I’m going to continue talking to Mr. Frank Stronek for another half an hour on the DailyWire Plus platform, a bastion of free speech in an increasingly sensorial world. And so if those of you who are watching and listening are inclined to devote your attention to that platform, that would be much appreciated and maybe increasingly necessary as the months unfold. I’m looking forward to coming and looking at your factory, Mr. Stronek. I think that would be very much fun. I love looking at industrial enterprises because, well, it’s lovely to see that much concerted and harmonious effort working out to produce things that people actually need. I really wish you luck with your new vehicle. I hope that you’ve hit the market dead on and that people find this vehicle inexpensive, reliable and useful, like many of your other products have been. And so that would be a lovely thing to see. It would be great to see that happening in Canada because we lack a little entrepreneurial zing at the moment. And that’s not as it should be. So… I didn’t get in the most important message. What’s my, called my main aim is, my main aim is I got about 10, 15 years ago, very heavily in the agriculture. The deeper I got in it, the more I could see this chemical jungle, with all the pesticide and all the fungicide. So 95% of the food eaten comes from industrial farms. On industrial farms, you see no more eagles fly away. There’s no more pheasants. There’s no more rapids. We spray everything with fungicide and pesticides. It gets in the air. We breathe it, gets the water. We drink that, gets in the soil. We eat the food. And all the kids’ procterologies and stage two diabetics is on the rise. So my main aim is, my main goal is, I don’t want to see any Canadian kid to go to school hungry. That means breakfast’s got to be served. I don’t want to see any Canadian kid to leave the school hungry. That means lunch has got to be served. And by law, it would state it has to be organic. I got every reasonable everything in, but there’s lots more to do where the public should know. Thank you. I enjoyed being with you. My pleasure, man. And we’ll meet in a couple of minutes on the Daily Wire side and then again in the future. And thanks again, everybody, for watching and listening today. I’m Jon Mribbitt. I’ll see you guys in the next one. Thank you.